Lodgerin: From 850 Rejections to a 7-Figure SaaS Business – with Óscar Rubio [436]

This is a machine-generated transcript.

[00:00:00] Omer: Oscar, welcome to the show.

[00:00:01] Oscar: Thank you, Omer.

[00:00:02] Omer: Do you have a favorite quote, something that inspires or motivates you that you can share with us?

[00:00:06] Oscar: I always say that I try, I like the quote of Edison who says, I tried a thousand times over to do it grown, so at the end I make it right. So something like that.

[00:00:21] Omer: Yeah. Sweet. So tell us about lodger in, what does the product do? Who's it for, and what's the main problem you're helping to solve?

[00:00:28] Oscar: Alright. Lodgerin is a digital ecosystem who digitalize and make easy the mobility ecosystem. With this, people who is moving abroad for medium term, let's say four or five months throw our platform, they have the possibility to get all the services that they may need from housing.

To lawyers, banks, insurances, and then make all the processes that they may have to do during this stage through our technology, checking, checkout, rental payments documents, exchange with these service providers, everything just in one platform.

[00:01:06] Omer: Got it. And then so you serve organizations who maybe have employees moving to a different.

Country and helping them make that move, connect with the services. But then you also have universities where students may be moving across. Countries And you're providing a similar service there?

[00:01:28] Oscar: Correct? Exactly. Basically what we do, it's to provide to organizations and into organizations we consider companies, corporates or international universities who send people abroad helping them with all these services through technology.

[00:01:43] Omer: Great. And you were explaining this to me a little bit earlier, that it's basically a multi-sided marketplace where on the one hand you've got these organizations like companies and universities, you've got the service providers who deliver on those services, like you said, bank services or whatever housing and so on that people may need, and then you have the actual users.

Who could be employees, students, whoever. And it sounds, it just blows my mind thinking about just the dynamics of something there. But it's gonna be great to unpack that a little bit. But what I think is interesting here with your story is that the SaaS business has really was the result of a pivot back in 2022.

Which formed this business. But you were running a services version of this business from what, since 2013?

[00:02:31] Oscar: Correct. Correct. I start as a relocation company, so after I got some traction with customers, I realized that the issues wasn't where the people get the service of having the house or having the lawyer or et cetera, the problems still comes.

When they arrive with the housing provider or during the stay with several incidents, et cetera. So at the end, what I did is throw the customers I had, I was validating the issues they may have during the stay. So at the end, I make longer the service providing until I get. Everything they need during the whole estate.

So basically it was learning from customer experience what they need. I try to solve every aspect. They may have to during the stage, and that is how I start as traditional relocation company that later on I expand in other business for property managers. So at the end. I was making everything traditional until Covid and during those, I think it was yeah, seven, eight years of experience, I learned perfectly fine what the customers need, the providers need and how to make it.

The only difficulty that I got on that. And on that time it was the scalability of the business. It was traditional service providing. So at the end to escalate the business, I need more employees, more people, more employees be physically in the locations where I was providing the service.

And that was difficult or capital intensive, let's say. So at the end, that was the challenge in that moment.

[00:04:09] Omer: Were you serving the same types of customers? Before with this relocation business? Or was it universities and businesses and all of that stuff?

[00:04:19] Oscar: Yeah. Yeah. Ba basically the same same organizations, same, type of customers in terms of corporates and universities and in the other side housing managers or property managers and banks, insurances companies, that kind of stuff.

Same kind of customer. Yeah.

[00:04:37] Omer: So for anyone who's listening to this and who's been told the mantra about one ICP one ideal customer profile, their head is probably exploding right now. Thinking about how you would even go about getting started when you've got so many. Different potential customers and users and service providers.

So how did you end up in this place? Was this kind of, was it just accidental? Was as the opportunities came along, it just grew organically or was it more of an intentional thing?

[00:05:10] Oscar: At the beginning it was analyze what the customer needs and try to solve it. So it's like when you are when you are push pulling on, on a strip, so you start to pulling the strip and at the end you see the whole picture, right? So we started with housing and then we realized that the people needs or ask for services in lawyers and services with the bank account or with the city hall registration or with that kind of stuff. So we start to expand the portfolio of services through partners.

So it was simple. At the end, we, what we did is coordinate and try to solve the situations on the problems that the customer have. So it's customer centric idea. Basically you analyze what they need and try to solve it and make it cheaper for them or in a site cheaper, in a good way to do it.

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Book your free one hour strategy session with their leadership team before the end of May at gearhart io. That's gearheart io. So you're running the business, seven, eight years. It's growing organically. You mentioned some of the scalability issues that you need to keep hiring more people to keep growing the business.

And then Covid comes along and then what happens?

[00:07:08] Oscar: And then, eh, shock. Shock in every way. Mobility, close barriers or frontiers between countries, closed flights, cancellations, everything closed. So imagine that you have been growing during seven years being sustainable financially and operationally and everything.

And suddenly one day to another, everything stops my mind blew up. It, it was a shock for me. I didn't know how to act, how to react. My operations Chief Operations Officer, which is the actual Chief Operations officer at Doering, he, men, fire everyone, including me, and save all the money that you can and start over when this storm has passed away.

So in that moment, I was so blocked to react. So I keep the business in the same way, but I just start to think how to solve the situation, how to pass the situation. And the only idea who comes to my mind, it was make more processes, be more international, be more scalable. So there is when my, the idea of launching, which at the end is digitalize processes and provide the platform and our expertise that we have got during eight years.

To the customers and the service providers, et cetera, put it into a technology part. So during Covid, what we were doing and at the office, imagine 150 square meters, empty office, full of tables. My chief operations officer and me putting papers on the walls. Utilize every process that we have been doing during eight years.

So that was the first idea we had. And it's how everything start over after Covid being more scalable and being more digital, becoming a traditional company into our traditional companies, into digital ecosystem, a technological company.

[00:09:15] Omer: And because we didn't mention this earlier, but the additional challenge was that you were bootstrapping business. You didn't have investors or a whole bunch of, money to in the bank?

[00:09:26] Oscar: No not even. Not even co-founder to cry?

No. It just me. I'm luck because I have a really good family, really good wife who helped me during those difficult times. As I said, I have a chief operation officer who was with me in some part of that help. But yes it's tough. I think that there is two kind of entrepreneurs I.

The ones who need somebody to launch and grow, and they need it because his personality needs somebody and the other ones who are like me, who it's difficult to manage with more people, more, more co-founders to get the final result that you want. So at the end, I'm coming from, business degree as well.

And I consider businesses as sustainable way, and they must have dividends and they must have positive financials in order to grow strong. So my idea, first idea was to validate the business, validate the service, and get my financials. With my customers, not with money coming from outside and then saying what you have to do or not, or et cetera.

Now it's true that we are in a moment that we are rising funds. We raised in December, 2023, 400K as CDS, and now we are looking for CDSA. But we are in a moment that we have validated the market. We have validated idea, we have traction. We have been increasing the multiples on the company during three years in a row.

So now I'm feeling that I'm in the possibility to grow in a strong way. So that is why we are looking for invest. But people when start business, they are always focusing in getting money and then validate and create the technology and et cetera. So at the end. First start and get validation with your customers, not with your ideas, with your customers.

And afterwards you will you can start to think in getting invest, but first of all, you must validate the idea in real market with real customers. That is the, that is my idea. That is my, my, my thoughts about it.

[00:11:52] Omer: Yeah. And it paid off. You told me about the revenue, the growth trajectory.

Can you just run through that in terms of how you grew from 2022 to. To where you are right now?

[00:12:01] Oscar: Sure. We are still not Microsoft. We will do at some point, but we start with 2022. First year it was 171,000. 2023 we closed with 420 thousand something in revenue. And this year, 2024, we closed with 1.2 million with every year with an EBITDA positive margin around 14%.

[00:12:30] Omer: Is that Euros or dollars?

[00:12:32] Oscar: Euros. Euros, yeah. We just opened the company here in US. So basically we have a holding with the companies in Spain and us, and we are opening Dubai during this year. So yeah, at the end the holding before that it was in Spain, so that is why it's in Euros the revenue.

[00:12:52] Omer: So the last three years, obviously, you've turned things around, gone from that, that very difficult period in, during Covid to getting to the first. Million, million in ARR and continuing to grow beyond that. Tell me what it was like when, during Covid, when you're going through this dark period where it looks like there's no way out for this business.

Everything has come to a halt. You talked a little bit about how you eventually figured out what you were gonna do and to look at the processes and automation and eventually move towards a technology or a SaaS business. But a lot of founders get into this space where things look really grim and it just feels like this hole is getting deeper and it feels like harder and harder to climb out of it.

So what was that like for you, and then how did you pull yourself out and start moving forward again?

[00:13:46] Oscar: I think one of my best things is the resilience that I have. I'm not the smart, the smartest guy in the planet. I'm not the, but I like so much and I believe so much in what I'm doing.

And at the end, during Covid, it was always the belief of this is gonna pass, this is gonna pass, this is gonna pass. So what we did to try to survive is to find other source of revenues according our business to, to try to keep it at least in zero or net, let's say, so we have, for instance people who abandoned the houses, right?

But they left everything in the house. So we start to coordinate, get the staff, and send it back home. So with that, we get a revenue source, for instance, or we have another people who says, I want to get a report about numbers and et cetera. And we have a lot of data on the, on our platform, et cetera, right?

So we start to create reports. So when you have needs your brain start to have ideas from everywhere, and if you have that of trying to survive, you find a way. You always find a way. It's true that it's difficult and it's tough, and I'm not gonna lie you, I thought to quit several times during that process.

But here I am.

So not only you, but you solo founder, you're also. A nontechnical founder. So once you decide that, okay, I've got this order, this is the direction I'm going, I'm gonna build a software business, SaaS business a lot of people will say I wanna do this, but I need to find a technical co-founder first, and or I can't do this for whatever reason.

[00:15:40] Omer: That didn't hold you back. How did you get around that? Because you still don't have a technical co-founder, but you're still building the business.

[00:15:46] Oscar: There is. There is always a way. There is always a way. If you want to make it, there is always a way. So on my end, I. The first step that I did is what they want to create, what I need to create this, and I start to learn myself about how to create it.

Not of course to write code but yes to, to how everything is it's working, that in that area. But it's happened the same. If you don't know about marketing or you don't know about finances or, I know a lot of entrepreneurs who are CEOs, they don't have business background and at the beginning they don't know how much they are paying for social security or how much they are paying in taxes or what is a balance sheet or why amortization on an asset, right?

Or if they, the technology that they are doing, it's amortizable or not. So at the end is, I think every aspect on life, you can learn about it. You have to spend hours, you have to have a plan. You must get people who knows more than you, because at the end when you don't know something, and all the people.

Have something that they don't know. It's find a way to learn it. So on my side, what I did, first of all, it was learning about how to do what I want to do and afterwards find the right people in the team to execute the plan. It's easier than it looks. So at the end, for people who says, no, I don't have the technical ideas, or I don't have the technical knowledge, or I don't have the marketing knowledge, you can solve everything.

The first thing you must do is start and validate the idea and get the customer and make mistakes. Be flexible and adapt yourself and adjust everything that you must adjust to get to the point. The expression paralysis by analysis, right? We the human being. It's always analyzing and thinking, and 80% of the things that you are thinking don't happen don't make an end.

So at the end. I think that is the biggest issue that you may have, it's true that you must have something learned before, but it's easy. You find a way, you find the people who can teach you, and that's it.

[00:18:17] Omer: So before you started building the first version of the software or the MVP you talked about validating the problems with customers.

But in many ways had, hadn't you already done that for eight years before, like weren't you like, okay, I know this, I'm gonna jump into building the software now.

[00:18:33] Oscar: I'm always have meetings with the customers. Even if now that I'm CEOI have salespeople, I've, I always like to know about what are the client's concerns and I always.

I'm sewing and I'm sharing my ideas. I'm creating this. How do you feel about it? And make prototypes. I'm creating this. How do you see this possibility for your customer? Do you see interesting or not? With these small questions, this small interviews, this is small meetings. You are validating already the customer and then the most difficult part, which is validate if what you are delivering, they are willing to pay for it.

Which is important. So at the end it's a process, but as soon as you do it one time your brain make it automatically. So it's always the same process. It's about processes at the end. So when we are launching a new functionality at our software, or we are launching a new product or whatever. We always follow the same steps.

Validate first with the customers, show my ideas, collect the feedback, and then start to make it according what the customer needs. It's true that we all have ideas, really good ideas. I going to create this app or this software or this at the end, you need to create something that people wants to pay for it and need it.

It's, it is the way that you are going to sell. So if you create something that you think it's important, but it's important just for you, or the market is so small, you are not going to success. So at the end in our site, it was simple, validated with the customer.

[00:20:24] Omer: So you're learning about building software, something that's new to you.

You are, you're building a vision of what this product is going to do, and you're having conversations with customers. About just validating, getting feedback and seeing how much interest there is you. You start hiring people, building a team around you who can build the software or execute on this vision.

What was the first version of that product? How much did it do, and how long did it take you to close that first? The first sale to prove that they would pay for it.

[00:21:02] Oscar: Do you know what I do? What I am still doing? I keep each version of the product that we are launching, and I have still, the first version of the product we launch, it was 2022.

It was Marketplace of Housing where students can make the reservation of the housing. In, in, in the website, right? Airbnb for students. If you see the user experience the product itself, it was, my gosh I remember that nobody understand how to make a reservation. It was so complicated.

So complicated. The process of creating a property into the software, it was super difficult to understand, super difficult. So at the end, the first version doesn't matter what clear you have, your ideas is going to be difficult, but you must launch and you must test, and you must receive feedback because the margin of improvement.

Improvement is unlimited always. So if you wait to have the perfect product. It's never gonna happen.

[00:22:16] Omer: Did anybody pay for that first version, or did you have to go back and start making it better?

[00:22:21] Oscar: At the beginning? At the beginning we got money or revenue from complete reservation. So we didn't make a process where the housing owners has the availability of their housing updated.

So we received thousands of requests for the housing that we have in our platform. But as we didn't have the availability, housing owners were canceled, cancel cancel, cancel. So we lost in the first quarter, we lost a. We didn't have, because that simple mistake have a calendar to update the availability.

So afterwards we start to improve that part, et cetera, and we start to get the revenue that we were expecting.

[00:23:07] Omer: Okay. Wait so the business model at the time was you would get paid if somebody completed a reservation, like a student.

[00:23:14] Oscar: With the technology. It was like Airbnb for students.

[00:23:19] Omer: Right?

And so people were booking. And then you were realizing that there wasn't availability for a bunch of these properties, and so the money that you thought you were gonna get, you weren't because the calendars on the property owner's side weren't up to date.

[00:23:32] Oscar: Exactly. Simple mistake.

We were making everything regarding the housing owner in terms of pictures, information housing conditions contract conditions, everything. But we didn't realize about availability because we said, wow, it's gonna be available. It's thousand of housing right in there. Is going to be available dates, no, this date is not working well because we have a group who is coming in two weeks.

So that part, which seems simple and understandable, it was a tough part of the technology. And that was the first mistake after that mistake. Another 10,000 mistakes, let's say during the process. So it's like that you are learning from mistakes.

[00:24:17] Omer: So you fix, so then you go back presumably and you fix the availability problem so they can update.

And so on. What was the next piece? Because I know most of the growth that came wasn't from these transactional things. It was. From going out and doing direct sales. And so how did that come about and how did you find those first, say the first 10 customers.

[00:24:40] Oscar: At the end we always said that what we try to do with Lodgerin is to solve problems.

So when we start to, to make the sales to organizations such as corporations or universities, we analyze what are their problems regarding the international mobility, where they are, they were suffering more, right? So at the end, we realized that the housing was the main pain. And then the incidents that happened during the states.

Regarding the housing, I dunno, humidity or they make the check in and the housing is not what it looks like in the pictures or to make the payments. The housing owners wants to make it by wire transfer, but they want to pay by card. All the issues that they may have. That at the end were received by the organizations, by the companies and the universities.

Imagine sending people abroad and receiving, eh, my landlord is not giving me this, or I have to change, but I don't know where to look. So at the end, we start to customize all the project with these organizations to provide them aside the technology and all this. Issues they may have providing them the solution to these issues.

So the first customers, the first customer, it was coming to us instead, us coming to them, we were making, I remember entering in the Office of International Mobility in Comillas, which is a university in Madrid, selling the service, the product, everything. And I never heard about them in three, four months.

And then I receive a call and they told me, Oscar, we don't need the housing, but we need this issue that we have with emergencies that happen during the states with the housing. Can you provide this? And that is how it start to solve a process and a problem making an customized project for them, including the housing.

And that was the first customer. And then. It's true that in our sector, in our market referral. Works really well, and it's a small sector, so universities and companies talk each other and recommend luxury as company to use for these issues, and that is how we start to generate the first 10 customers.

But to be honest, to get 10 customers before the first customer I made 800 meetings, 850 meetings, something like that.

[00:27:19] Omer: 850 meetings with potential customers?

[00:27:22] Oscar: Correct. And do you imagine entering with no appointment because they didn't answer the phone or they didn't reply the email or things like that?

Going directly to the office. Knock the door and say, hi, I'm Oscar. I'm coming here to sell you this. And, but not just in Spain, I take a flight coming us and going university by university with my car, sleeping in models and doing like that. And that was the beginning of this story.

[00:27:58] Omer: Wow. It's I think a lot of people just.

Wish that they hear this, they see this stuff on X or wherever, and it's so I just build a landing page and then run some Google ads and customers find me. But the reality is you often have to do a lot, do things that most people are not willing to do. And what you just told me there, I would say 99% of people.

I don't know if they would do ever do that.

[00:28:30] Oscar: It's resilience, resilience and adaptability to change to get the customer. That's it. That's it. No, it, it's, when I always tell this story, people say, wow, it's not, wow. It's simple. It's quite simple to be honest. Everyone can do that, but you must have the resilience to don't get paid for long term.

Be in a car, be far from your home, going knocking doors and do that.

[00:29:01] Omer: But what kept you going? How many times did you need to be rejected before you say, okay enough?

[00:29:05] Oscar: I believe it. I believe it. You know how I start all this because I was studying my degree in Leeds uk and when I was there. I have a lot of issues with the housing and I saw a lot of people with a lot of issues with housing changing houses, problems with the housing owners, having problems with the social security to get the social security number open, the bank account.

And I said, if one company for small money wasn't this business, I will hire them because at the end it's suffering a process that should be super good process. Or super enjoyable process. So I believe on this since long term. So I think my believing, my, my first person experience was the key to keep there.

And then to be honest it's a matter of personality as well. I always like, build projects and run businesses.

[00:29:58] Omer: So it sounds like the thing that kept you going was a lot of the times founders will, talk to 10, 20, 30, 40 potential customers get nowhere and eventually the energy fades out.

Or they decide this is the wrong thing to do. And the thing that kept you going was, from what I'm hearing is that. Because you had experienced this personally, you were absolutely convinced that this was a painful problem that needed to be solved, and they just needed to understand how this solution could help them.

[00:30:31] Oscar: Exactly. But as well I know it, I knew it that, that they have that issue as well. The only thing is that everyone is so busy with their daily task and they don't focus on how to solve those issues because they are focusing in their own staff. So when somebody comes to sell, always says no, because I don't have the time to focus on you.

But when they start to listen and they realize, oh alright, I will, I'm gonna use it. So at the beginning it's like that. You are going to receive a lot of nos and again, I'm not gonna lie, it's tough. It's tough to keep going. But if you believe it and you know it, not believe it, you know it, just keep going.

[00:31:19] Omer: So after those 800, 850 rejections. What happened? Tell me about the time that somebody said yes.

[00:31:28] Oscar: The first customer I had, as I told you, the comedian, I remember all my family, my brother saying, congratulations, you did it. And no, I didn't did it. I just closed one customer. And now is when the fan begins.

I remember the guy at the university who was managing what we were doing. So for two heart attacks in several years, coordinating all the staff of housing arrivals, et cetera. So at one point, somebody at the university says, wait, you are not here for this. We must externalize this. As we were the ones who were knocking doors and saying, I have this service.

I have this to provide you. They said, all. Let's go with them. Let's try with them. So after I remember it was super painful. It was like six months negotiating the contract, insurances everything into the contract. We close it and afterwards when you think that you have it is when everything starts because you start to receive problems from every site, and then you must start to recruit people and you must have an operations.

Team who get formatting during the process of learning. So it's quite complicated at the beginning. You need time to learn and to implement new features new processes, improvements. But if the customer is loyal and they see on you that you are there to make it done well, they trust on you.

Because alternative maybe it's more expensive or maybe it's not there or it's not willing to do what you are willing to do when you are starting. Because when you are starting, you are willing to do everything they need to solve the situation and that is, is what's gets you more customers and improvements and everything.

[00:33:29] Omer: Let's talk a little bit about fundraising. You the original relocation business. It was bootstrapped for at least a couple of years when you pivoted and started to build this SaaS business, you continued to bootstrap the business. You got to seven figures in ARR. What was the driver for you?

'cause I know you talked about saying, Hey, building a sustainable business that I can scale is important. So what eventually drove you to raising money 'cause you raised, what was it, 400,000 euros?

[00:34:05] Oscar: 400. 400,000 Euros. Same story that with customers. It was here it was 955 meetings with potential investors from August.

I have the list. I have the list from August, 2023 to December 2023. To get four investors for those 400,000, and it was crazy at the end. The reason of rising money is growth and expansion, but big plans of expansion. So now after the rising in 2023, which it was difficult, et cetera. I must say that I got the right investors because they support a lot.

We multiply per three, all the KPIs. I show them that the business plan is possible. Now we are opening another investment round for the end of this year. The actual investors are making follow on this invest to keep the growing plans that we have at the end. Now we were established last year in US.

Because we were in Spain, even if we were operating in Italy, Portugal and Spain. Now we are operating aside Spain, Italy, Portugal, France, UK, Dubai, and US, and we have a plan of expansion that is going to be really strong, really capital intensive. So that is why we are rising funds basically, and we rise and why we rise funds one year ago.

[00:35:53] Omer: All right. We should wrap up here. So let's get onto the lightning round. I've got seven quick fire questions for you. You ready? Let's go. What's one of the best pieces of business advice you've received?

[00:36:06] Oscar: Every problem has a solution.

[00:36:08] Omer: What book would you recommend to our audience and why?

[00:36:11] Oscar: From one, From Zero to 1 Million of Peter Thiel.

You realize about adaptability and how to change to get that figure. But make this lean startup way of get it.

[00:36:27] Omer: What's one attribute or characteristic in your mind of a successful founder?

[00:36:31] Oscar: Oh, resilience, of course.

[00:36:35] Omer: What's your favorite personal productivity tool or habit?

[00:36:39] Oscar: Running at at morning.

I think it's provides you all the strength that you need for the day and liberate your stress or on your head so you can start fresh every day.

[00:36:53] Omer: What's a new or crazy business idea you'd love to pursue if you had the time?

[00:36:56] Oscar: [Inaudible] for entrepreneurs who don't have resources. From Africa or some other areas. They don't have the resources or the education, but they have the ideas and they have things to, to be successful, but they don't have the people around to do it.

[00:37:21] Omer: What's an interesting or fun fact about you that most people don't know.

[00:37:25] Oscar: I refund the receipt of my mobile line. To ask my wife, to marry me to buy the ring.

I refund the invoice of the phone because I didn't have money and the car.

[00:37:41] Omer: Wow.

[00:37:42] Oscar: I refund the invoice because I was expecting payment of another client. So in the meanwhile. So I do it in that way. So yeah, 2014.

[00:37:54] Omer: Love it. And finally, what's one of your most important passions outside of your work?

[00:37:58] Oscar: My family, my children. The best. The best.

[00:38:02] Omer: Oscar, thank you. It's been a pleasure talking just, we often hear about resilience and how important it is for founders. But some of the numbers that you just gave me and this list that you've been tracking about the number of rejections before you got your first customer, the number of hundreds of founders investors you had to talk to, that is a living, breathing example of resilience.

And now that I'm, I'm in Florida now, right? So I'm just a few hours away from you. If I ever want to improve my resilience and get better at taking rejection, I'm just gonna drive down to Miami and hang out with you for a while because it's, as I told you, every problem has a solution and at the end, if you enjoy what you are doing.

[00:38:44] Oscar: You will get it after or sooner, but you will have it with, as I told you before. Everyone wants everyone every, everything now, and you must be patient in some point.

[00:38:57] Omer: Love it. All right. So if people want to find out more about Lodgerin, they can go to Lodgerin, that's lodgerin.com?

[00:39:07] Oscar: Exactly.

lodgerin.com.

[00:39:08] Omer: And if folks wanna get in touch with you, what's the best way for them to do that?

[00:39:11] Oscar: LinkedIn is where I'm more active is where I'm receiving everyday messages and connections and I think it's the best way to connect with me.

[00:39:20] Omer: We'll include a link to your profile in the show notes as well, so people can find you more easily.

Awesome. Thank you my friend. It's been a pleasure. And I wish you and the team the best of success.

[00:39:28] Oscar: Thank you. Thank you very much. You pass by Miami, let me know.

[00:39:31] Omer: I will definitely.

Okay. Cheers.